Sunday, December 12, 2010

Hyperpreterist World - in it all together

[caption id="attachment_2105" align="alignleft" width="200" caption="Hyperworld"]Hyperworld[/caption]

Well, it's that time again. Come along as we look into the wacky world of Hyperpreterists. What person is trying to be the center of attention this week? What are they fighting over? Who has compromised with whom just to keep the "movement" unified?

Up first is Mike Loomis, formerly known as "psychomike" (a name of his own choosing). Loomis, like many hyperpreterists was either unemployed, underemployed or on disability/welfare (giving them lots of time to start websites).

Loomis decided to take this free time and start a "preterist radio station". In reality, it is merely an internet site with hyperpreterist podcasts. Loomis co-hosts a podcast called, "The Sam Frost Show" (no arrogance there), where hyperpreterist Sam Frost spends most of the time talking about himself and more time talking over Loomis. On the June 30, 2010 episode of the show, Frost said I (Roderick Edwards) seriously needed to be under 24-hour mental institution care (clip). Later, Loomis sent me and Brian an email to apologize. The email said:
"I want to apologize for the content of this last weeks Sam Frost Show. Brian...You got my goat. 8)

The three of us are all very passionate about our beliefs. I personally and won't nor will I allow any of the guest from this point forward to level personal attacks.

Sorry...And God Bless you both"
I asked Loomis to state this publicly and reprimand Frost publicly. To date, there is not a peep out of Loomis. What I found interesting, is that after Loomis recently ribbed fellow hyperpreterist, Ed Hassertt for Hassertt's seemingly continuous disagreement with the various podcasts on Loomis' "radio station"; another hyperpreterist (Wanda Short) ribbed Loomis back saying:
"Funny thing...with ALL the different viewpoints and diverse teachings, I have yet to see YOU disagree with ANYONE!!!! (at least not while on air with that person." (source)
Ahhhh, so I'm not the only one that noticed that Loomis not only will not PUBLICLY hold his fellow hyperpreterists to account (such as Frost) but in his effort to build his little empire, Loomis just lets anything pass as long as it contains the "preterist" label. This brings us to a perennial quote by hyperpreterists:
" Gary DeMar. I disagree with him...Nonetheless he makes more full preterist's than the rest of us combined." (source)
This is something I've constantly pointed out. DeMar sits safely in the "orthodox" chair while "making more [hyper] preterists than the rest" of the hyperpreterists combined. DeMar will not take responsibility for this, claiming it is not his fault.

Dee Dee Warren and the PreteristBlog gang used to point this kind of stuff out, but that was before her little followers desired to be so much like her highness that they have begun to make podcasts that sound like her. (source)

Moving along. Our favorite gaffe-o-matic, Sam Frost is still at it. After a recent tiff with the Dave Green-PreteristCosmos group, Frost has been trying all he can to get back into their good graces. His latest effort is to return to the circle-the-wagons tactic.
"The thing my friends get about me is that I go off the cuff sometimes. I always end up apologizing, and am trying to tame that aspect of my life. Ed Hassertt and I both do it, as we have admitted. I speak my mind, and need to think before I speak many times." (source)
So, Frost admits he often speaks without thinking. Not a very mature position, especially for someone who has claimed to be a "pastor". Then to clinch the deal, Frost as he has done many times before claims I'm simply trying to turn his fellow hyperpreterists against him (as if his own words and actions aren't doing it), Frost says:
"...he [Roderick] actually has the gall to turn around and try to pit me against you guys! We all see your tactic, Roderick. It fails here. It won't work. It will never work. We have all put too much blood, swea[t] and tears in this TOGETHER, and that's what you never understood. That's what you never got. I promote this site. I promote Dave Green and Ed Hassertt, in spite of sharp, sharp disagreements. We all know,
that, at bottom, we are in this together." (source)
No cultic mentality there. Frost wants people to rally around him because he's their fellow hyperpreterist and hey, he's promoted them. I mean, maybe they wouldn't have as much validity if Frost the "presumed scholar" of the movement hadn't promoted them. I love the hyperpreterist line "we are in this together". I wonder if that is what Jim Jones said right before he passed out the dixie cups?

So who else is in the hyperpreterist news??? Where is Don Preston? He has had a failure to launch since he dumped his congregation because it wouldn't fund his dreams (source). Virgil Vadua is still up to his socialist/postmodern/Emergent ways; now trying to get some Nazarenes to buy into his junk. (source)

The Covenant Creationist group; containing Tim Martin, Jeff Vaughn, Tami Jelinek, John Scargy, Ward Fenley and others are still trying to hold their own but seem to be less and less concerned with joining Frost in his attempt to make the movement into his own private version of ETS (source). Jelinek says:
"[We] have no interest in being part of 'the preterist movement' (so-called), or the 'preterist camp'...It's pretty much why you don't see links to other "preterist" sites at [Jelinek's and Fenley's site]." (source)
This same distancing went on when the Max King/Tim King group got tired of the constant spiraling chaos within the movement. Tim King said:
"We saw that 'preterism' was an aggressive 1990s sectarian approach to biblical eschatology, and it had lost its ability to relate to the church and society in a constructive, healthy manner.

By July 1999, we felt we needed to take steps to go beyond "preterist" divisiveness and the side-stream movement it had become." (source)
If Frost continues to attempt to dominate the movement, he will eventually alienate his fellow hyperpreterists, which is ironic since Frost often claims I'm trying to destabilize his group when in reality, I hope his brand continues to press against the other groups. It will be Frost himself that destroys the hyperpreterist movement -- especially if as predicted he joins with his mentor, Kenneth Talbot of Whitefield Theological Seminary. After all, Talbot has CLEARLY stated that he can't determine if hyperpreterism as a whole is a heresy.
"Whitefield Theological Seminary maintains that Full (Hyper) Preterism is a ‘very dangerous’ theological error. Further, some Full (Hyper) Preterists may be heretical pending on their other doctrines as it relates to God, Christ, Man, and Salvation. Each individual would need to be interviewed for me to make that determination." (Talbot -- source)
Huh? So, hyperpreterism is only a "pending" heresy? Each individual would need to be interviewed??? But Frost just told us, they are "all in it together". I guess we have to consider that Talbot allowed Frost, a known hyperpreterist to help develop the seminary's Hebrew program, and has personally known Frost so closely for over 10 years that they often literally have taco lunches together. You think that would be enough time for Talbot to "determine" if Frost is promoting a heresy. Judging by Talbot's actions, it seems he is perfectly okay with hyperpreterism (despite his various articles to the contrary).

This brings us to a cronie of Talbot's -- Phil Naessens. You all remember Naessens don't you? This is the guy who goes around threatening to sue everyone if they dare say anything negative about him or what he is teaching. Well, Naessens' little group is now going after Dr. James White.
"Unless Dr. White was forced to attend Fuller he chose to go to a heretical school for spiritual training. Based on his claims of his research ability and his chastisement towards others who he believes don’t research very well (as evidenced in the link to DL you asked us to listen to) I find it odd that he didn’t know Fuller was a liberal seminary, don’t you?...Dr. White is Reformed and his listing of a heretical school on his bio lends credibility to Fuller...It would be nice if he would place some sort of disclaimer next to that entry on his bio, don’t you think?" (source)
Amazing!!! Naessens is one of the most hypocritical people I know. This is the same man who claimed he is accountable to the Greek Orthodox Church and then in another breath told us he told the Patriarch of the GOC to kiss his butt.

Speaking of buts...we can see from where all of this hypocrisy comes. Frost and the hyperpreterists aren't the only ones that have a circle-the-wagons mentality of cultic cronyism. Naessens in further defending one of his cronies said:
"I’ve known Phil Perkins since the day I started this site. In fact he linked to one of my first articles. One thing I can tell you about him is this; He rarely if ever comments on subjects he knows nothing about and I suspect he knows more about Dr. White then he’s letting on." (source)
Um yeah, it comes down to that fact that Perkins is one of Naessens cronies. Naessens said something similar when he tried to defend Ted Haggard:
"For those of you that don’t know Ted Haggard encouraged me at a time when I was going to shut this site down." (source)
So, we see it is true; like the hyperpreterists who say they're "all in it together" it appears there is a weird symbiotic relationship with folks like DeMar, Talbot, Dee Dee Warren, Naessens and the hyperpreterists. They are certainly "all in it together". Dee Dee once said, after accepting funding from hyperpreterists to keep her site going:
"Despite theological differences, I do believe that we can be friends and bear one another’s burdens." (source)
Really??? We Christians are supposed to "bear the burdens" with heretics?...well I guess if they give you money or talk to you sweetly you're supposed to according to Dee Dee. Yep, "all in it together".

Well, that about wraps up our look into the relevant happenings within the hyperpreterist movement. Where else are you going to get this kind of reporting? Where else are you going to find the extensive source linking?

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