Spitting Spat Over Terms: FULL vs HYPER

As the Kenneth Talbot-led ex-"Full Preterists" start to wake up to the things some of us longer term "formers" have been saying; it becomes amusing or perhaps vindicating to read what they eventually write.  For example,
when Sam Frost first left the movement he said:

"I won't belittle you as "hyper-preterists" or "heretics" or any of those things. I know that doesn't work. It just inflames passions. Pointless, actually. You are made in God's image, and on that basis alone, worthy of respect. I will try my hardest. " -- source Jan 12, 2011

But a little over a year later, on Jan 25, 2012 Frost said this to a group of hyper-preterists:

"...the term, historically, "hyper-preterist" was not invented by FP. It came from a July, 1997 Chalcedon Report article (Kenneth Gentry). It applied to us regular FP. Later, FP picked it up and applied it to folks like Chris Camillo, "Taffy" and the like in order to distance themselves from the term. I don't like revisionism." -- source Jan 25, 2012

This is significant because it shows that Frost may finally be getting it.  The prefix HYPER is not meant as a pejorative but as a grammatically accurate qualifier.  Saying a person is a Full-Preterist is as senseless as saying a person is a "Full-Calvinist" if and when they go beyond (hyper) historic Calvinism.

But the hyper-preterists where Frost posted this are threatening him with banishment if he continues.  Hyper-preterist Tami Jelinek had this to say about the issue:

"We are not "hyper-preterists" (the moderators of this site, nor anyone I know of who posts here regularly). Personally, I *do* consider hyper-preterism heretical. In fact I do not consider hyper-preterists believers, or Christians. To anyone posting here who is referring to any of us as "hyper-preterists": this language needs to stop immediately or you will not continue to post here." -- source

Comparing Frost's comments to Jelinek's, it is apparent that she is doing exactly as Frost said; engaging in "revisionism".  That is, it is like a liberal Democrat trying to deny his views are ideologically socialistic.  Just who are these "hyper-preterists" Jelinek wouldn't consider believers or Christians and why does she think Christians should consider her a believer or a Christian?  Jelinek calling others heretical is like a Mormon calling a Jehovah's Witness a cultist.

Lastly, on a little side note, Frost's sidekick, Jason Bradfield recently admitted this:

" Error begets error. I don’t think it is insignificant that hyperpreterism flourished in Church of Christ circles. That doesn’t account for all of it, but it certainly explains a great deal." -- source Jan 19, 2012

This is important because I early on pointed out that the Church of Christ denomination's "Restorationism" was a big factor in why so many of the first and still most predominant leaders within the Hyper-preterist movement come from the denomination. (see here, here, here)

So, while Frost and the other Talbot-led formers are too full of themselves to set aside their hatred for me, they are just now beginning to use the arguments many of us independent formers used almost a decade ago; and for which they lambasted us.  Maybe they can have a little humility and admit they were wrong and wrong to attack us for as long as they have.

Sam Frost: The Secret Full Preterist?

While Sam Frost was still within the FP movement, he often complained how it was not systematic enough.  It seemed he wanted to dictate how it would be presented.  Well, it appears he is still at it. Commenting on an article where the author was detailing how "partial-preterism", if consistent should/would lead to FPism, Sam said:

"And, I don't get FP's using this argument (I used to use it when David Engelsma was saying it). Do you want to drive people AWAY from your view? Scare them off?...[Instead] Here's what you should post: "this is what X said, and I quote X" Then, deal with X's actual words and show where they contradict Y in Scripture or in his own argument. Or, "if P, then Y" of necessary inference - but anything else, like this fellow writes, is speculation and useless "leads to" fearmongering......It's like bringing up Hitler in an argument....." -- link: http://deathisdefeated.ning.com/profiles/blog/show?id=2362512 

Talbot Says Sam Frost Isn't A Pastor

Long time egotist, Sam Frost likes to feign being an "expert" and if you've ever had the misfortune of engaging the man in a verbal discussion; you will have been talked-over and interrupted incessantly.  However, the lingering issue with Sam Frost; who in 2010-2011 recanted his 15+ years of teaching hyperpreterism is that Frost claims to have been a self-ordained "pastor" while he was a hyperpreterist.  It continues to be an issue because he continues to claim this credential as if it was ever legitimate.  Think about it.  Suppose a Mormon who had been an Elder in Mormonism at some point recants Mormonism.  Can he rightly claim he was EVER a leader within the Christian Church?  This is what Frost is trying to do.

But during a January 2012 podcast, Frost's mentor, Kenneth Talbot -- president of a seminary -- said this:

"You cannot appoint yourself a minister. It must be recognized and the gifts must be understood, examined and then he is to have hands laid on him by the presbytery. Self-ordination is rebuffed completely. It is not seen as anything viable. And it is literally an insult to the Church of Jesus Christ. He doesn't let you play fast and loose with His Word. And the Word is very specific about those things."

Listen to the 10 second audio: http://thekingdomcome.com/sites/default/files/falsepastor.mp3